Vitruvian Evans.


The figure is Watkins' height (72.5"). That's roughly ten square feet of additional target. Click to enlarge.

The figure is Watkins’ height (72.5″).
That’s roughly ten square feet of additional target.
Click to enlarge.

No Da Vinci here, but work with me on this.

I thought it might be useful to see visually how Mike Evans’ size and reach and vertical reflect in his catching radius when compared to a more conventionally sized wideout.  Think Red Zone.

If Andy Dalton can be have the second highest RZ/TD convert rate, imagine what Brian ‘Fade Route’ Hoyer will do with Mike Evans lined up with Gordon and Cameron.

Screen Shot 2014-02-18 at 9.05.14 AM Jordan+Cameron+Cincinnati+Bengals+v+Cleveland+7daxcWp6BD7l Screen Shot 2014-02-18 at 12.59.28 PM

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  • Warburton MacKinnon

    any chance in hell all the “top” Qb’s fall out of the first round? Just hope the Browns arn’t the first to pick one to early.

  • Warburton MacKinnon

    Ok, I want to go on record saying I don’t want JFF,just so I don’t have to read about him anymore,or at least not daily and weekly. Still hate all the draft talk but we are almost there….to the draft that is. Just from what I read,having seen 0 of the QBs play there seems to be at least a generaly consistent thought that none are worth the our pick at 4…since it’s a thought it seems most of the pundits and a reasonable amount of Browns fans have..seems we should avoid a QB at 4. If it wasn’t for Russel Wilsons existence and being the outlier on short mobile QBs I doubt JFF would be considered a first rounder by anyone other than true believers in JFF.

    • bupalos

      Disagree. Freakish athletes go in the 1st round, and whatever else you want to say, Manziel is that. He’s a half-crazed malevolent rabbit. Even with more flaws than he has, he’d be someone’s science project before pick 32.

      • actovegin1armstrong

        My Dearest Bupa, JFF is a science project, he is that “save the environment” de rigueur, preserve the world, science teacher’s Drosophila jar, where their little world booms and everything is fantastic, and then when all the little impressionable youths come to school the next morning and everything is dead.
        Never draft a quarterback or running back in the first three rounds!
        Jake Matthews, Kahlil Mack, or SamMikeEvanwatskins. Those are the only choices.
        With all due respect to jk, for the fourth pick, if he is that adamant about a player we should all climb aboard the Mike Evans train. JK, I apologize that I do not see it exactly as you do, but I also came very close to fighting a battle against 6″ amber monitors to go with the 6″ green monitors and that simple decision not to fight is still paying me to this day.
        I am willing to go with Evans. But can we at least try to get the 386 processor to work?

      • Warburton MacKinnon

        saw how that worked out with Tebow and denver did we not? I also don’t think are line is good emough or agile enough overall to really take advantage of a mobile QB, granted my sample size for that is only 2 QB’s and both played year 2 (for Cleveland in Senecas case)under Shurmer. Still I think our line is designed best for a pocket passer and decent RB, not sure if JFF is all that some think he is he wouldn’t be wasted with the personal we have,much the same way we were all sure Shurmer would have wasted the talent of Griffin..i wonder if our line doesn’t kind of make some of it a moot point. You don’t always change the system or personel for a new QB sometimes it best to get the right fit for the team we have. Note Hoyer was mauled running(but let’s not talk about his slide),McCoy was never the same after trying to run almost an inside option, Cribbs was destroyed by running from the QB position(or Harrison depending on how you look at it)…the line seldom did good when running the Wildcat O, JT and Mack were there through all of that perhaps they could do okay and not look lost but w/o 3 more mobile lineman it goes nowhere fast. History for this team kinda proves my point. RAC till Pettine our line is not built to work with a mobile QB,our best season record wise was with an imobile pocket passer don’t think that is a fluke. Maybe the line will change in the next two or three years and become something different but that won’t keep a mobile QB upright this year.

        • bupalos

          I’m not arguing we should take him, just that there is no way he slides through the whole 1st round this year or any year. He’s a WAY more rare talent than Tebow. Tebow’s just kind of a meh running back that can (sort of) throw a football, but sure loves him some Jebus. And yeah, even he went like 22 or so, so that kind of proves the point. Manziel has freakish escape instincts, a good arm, big brain, crazy speed, can throw from crazy angles, and cuts like a rabbit with his size 29 flipper-feet. I’m not arguing the Browns should use the 4 on him. I’m just arguing he is a slam dunk 1st rounder and I’ll be surprised if he gets out of the top 10. And I won’t scream in pain if they call him at 4 like I did for Weeden at 22 or would for Carr anywhere in the first 2 days.

          • Warburton MacKinnon

            Ok, maybe you have a point that there is enough to say he will be a first round pick…not actually SOLD that he should be…but metrics wise on some charts he seems to be perhaps the best..don’t know. Though I will admit I am forgetting about 3 teams that may really want him two in texas and one in florida,so if just because of that you are right he is then a slam dunk 1st rounder. I will also admit I want him to be on screen for 2 days and not be picked…that though is because I am an ass and for some reason want him to suffer.

          • bupalos

            Meh. He’s from Texas. West Texas. Kerrville. Same tiny town as my Dad. You have to cut these people some slack. It’s….different. You need to move these people way northeast to find their true human potential.

          • Warburton MacKinnon

            should I laugh or cry at that? Always knew something was off about you Bup….me I am a Browns fan I learned long ago to laugh and cry at the same time…..

          • actovegin1armstrong

            May we please have a Kerrville discussion?
            I am the guy who brought important stuff to Kerrville and I am still working on redundant pathways.
            I love Kerrville!
            I have coached at Hunt, own land off of 2107 between Kerrville and Lost Maples.
            Kerrville is heaven, well, with that inferno thing during the summer. There is however, the Sabinal, and the Frio.
            What are you thinking?
            Why are you and the beloved Bupettes living in the frozen tundra?
            Escape the clutches of the Arctic and hang out with the cool kids!
            I will buy you plenty of beers at Bill’s BBQ, or for even more fun that freaky place at 187 and 337. I am frequently there on a bicycle and very inebriated.

  • Petefranklin

    You could also make a circle chart of JFF scrambles and how he found Evans on broken routes beyond the actual route which would make me more comfortable with “Jesus Football” at 4 than either Watkins or Evans.

    • i have yet to read a piece on the webs about JFF having had last year’s #2 (joeckel) and two top tens this year (matthews + evans) to play with. imagine having three top-10 NFL players supporting you against college competition.

      i suspect manziel looks a lot like nathan scheelhaase without joeckel, matthews, and evans.

      • etc

        What would Manziel look like behind Mack, Schwartz and Thomas, throwing to Gordon and Cameron and someone similar to Evans?
        He may have been helped playing with a couple really good players, but an NFL team is generally 11 really good players, maybe Manziel would be just as good or better?

        Btw, I would rather have the best offensive line in the league. Just sayin’

      • mgbode

        and how many top10 picks played with Teddy Bridgewater? 😉

        • enhhhhh… this would be considered a big offensive line in the NFL let alone in The American. pretty nice for a qb to have a line that’s ~50 lbs bigger than the guy across from him. link.

          • bupalos

            Again, fat guys do not = good linemen, especially in pass protection. You got a single real prospect there? Watch the Florida tape. The guy was absolutely bum rushed and delivered time after time.

            Cinci’s line was built to deal with cupcakes. Every quality opponent busted it quick and dirty. And Teddy delivered. Meanwhile out in Fresno….

          • yes i know and we’ve discussed this before but day-umm. i guess we just disagree on whether the huge line yields an abnormal advantage for bridgewater. i think yes.

            but have discussed how peculiar it is the one QB with a stellar bowl performance capping his 2012 year went on to become the #1 prospect on several draft boards and the other is tajh boyd. i mean if it’s about the 2012 bowl performance, boyd should be ranking higher, no?

            that’s not good scouting either, so i’ll leave you with this which does ring factual: “He was not a favorite here even before that silly Glovegate incident at his Pro Day, when he didn’t wear gloves, as he always did in games, and threw badly under controlled conditions. Not an issue here as I never bought into high ratings given him by respected scouts and coaches anyway. He is not really a fluid athlete and that, combined with a frail appearing body, is a concern. Although Bridgewater has excellent geometry throwing ahead of receivers, his release point is too low. For a 6-foot-2 pocket passer, that is another concern.”

          • bupalos

            I think really big guys might be an advantage in the run game against second tier opponents. In the pass game? No. Not at all. Not even a little. And it shows on tape.

            The thing to me that is constantly underweighted by scouts, and that leads to your weedens and quinns and so forth is simply how their brains work in crisis. And I think it’s really the #1 thing. That’s what makes all the good NFL QB’s good. It comes before arm strength, hand size, speed, release point….everything. But it’s not a direct measurable. It’s hard to even decide fully what plays to look at. Sometimes there is a little rush issue that became a crisis in the QB’s brain that didn’t really even materialize. Sometimes things that look like extreme pressure on film weren’t even noticed before release. I just feel like when I watch bridgey he reacts the right way. He isn’t too aware of the rush or too ignorant of it, and he just reacts right and moves just right. I had the exact opposite feeling for Weeden (and Carr). But it’s just a feel thing, so we’ll see.

            BTW if the Browns end up with Carr or Bridgey doesn’t come to cleveland but is in the division, I want out of that side of the bet. So you have to think about what you will charge me to buy out in those cases.

  • RGB
    • Petefranklin

      Just because it’s full and foamy doesn’t mean it’s beer.

      • Warburton MacKinnon


  • jpftribe

    Kanick, I get your point on the math and all here, but Watkins is the real deal. In the previous article, you quoted the second half of Watkins review by McGinn, but you left out these little tidbits:
    “He’s so explosive,” one scout said. “Just like Tavon Austin was last
    year. He’s probably the most explosive guy in the draft.” Third-year
    junior. In 2011, joined Herschel Walker, Marshall Faulk and Adrian
    Peterson as the only freshmen to make the AP All-America first team.
    “Really a dynamic player,” said another scout. “He’s so good in and out
    of his breaks. He runs like a running back but he moves like a receiver.
    He has strong hands to snatch the ball. He’s going to be a real
    difference-maker.” Concluded with a devastating 16-catch, 227-yard
    outburst against Ohio State in the Tigers’ victorious Orange Bowl.
    Finished with 240 receptions for 3,391 yards (14.1-yard average) and 27

    We have Gordon and Cameron to run fade routes from the ten. This guy with the two of them can do some serious damage on the rest of the 100 yards of the field. This guy is in a class with Walker, Faulk and Peterson. I don’t think he is a fluke pick here.

    I too am a big Hoyer fan, but mainly because he is smart. You now have Hawkins to platoon with Benjamin in the slot and Tate and Lewis catching balls out of the backfield. If they can plug the hole at guard, I don’t think you need Aaron Rodgers to run this offense, someone is going to be open on a mismatch.

    • but i dont know what explosive means and i’d like to aim higher than just like tavon austin. i guess explosive helps you get separation and release from the line of scrimmage but i saw no problems for evans in getting off the line and if he needs to separate, his arms are three inches longer than any d-back he’ll meet.

      i mean put it this way: if youre picking between two wideouts of comparable speed and explosivity wouldnt you rather take the one whose catch area is ten square feet greater?

      btw, i think watkins’ orange bowl actually says (said) more about luke fickell than watkins. i mean, look at the second clemson TD drive. make an adjustment son.

      • jpftribe

        Got to 4 minutes in “that’s the Big 10’s leading tackler he is running over”. I don’t think scheming had a lot to do with it. Watch the guy block downfield on runs.

        By explosive, I think they mean big play capable. The guy turns flanker screens into 20+ yard gains down the sidelines, 12 yard gains up the middle, runs reverses and quick pitches out of the backfield, slaughters man to man and beats two deep safety coverage. And that was just against OSU.

        We already have a 6’3″, 200lb, 4.53 40 (same as Evans), 40.5″ vertical leap (three inches better than Evans) physical RAC No 2 receiver, his name is Greg Little.

        • jpftribe

          Truth be told, I would be happy to see either one of them in a no logo orange helmet. But if they are both there at No 4, Watkins is the guy.

        • [pretty sure that’s also the big 10’s leader in missed tackles.]

    • mgbode

      Just a point of clarification: Benjamin is no slot-WR. He’s an outside speed guy. Hawkins and Burleson are the slot WRs.

      • bupalos

        It’s going to be fun to see if we can drive the elder statesman Burleson insane with ill-advised slants like we did with Bob Marley.

        • mgbode

          Burleson’s body would never hold up. He gets injured ordering pizza.

  • Dave Kolonich

    I’m not totally against Evans – but I see more big play potential with Watkins. And regardless of those 3-5 exceptions from last year, the Browns’ offense is still mostly terrible. Let’s consider that T-Rich draft pick a luxury, which to me means it’s time to find a real player – not a “science experiment” like Mingo (Banner) – and let’s not get cute and trade down, only to burn picks to go back up (Heckert Special).

    Speaking of Mingo and more precisely, Kanick’s Bob McGinn post: I was catching up on some reading and read that, then clicked over to to see Tom Reed’s thingy on how he really (doesn’t) want(s) the Browns to draft Manziel – mainly because he has absolutely nothing to write about. That is about the most pathetic confession an NFL beat writer has ever made. With Mary Kay, you kind of expect her irrelevance. However, Reed is actually talented at what he does – albeit extraordinarily lazy in this case. Instead of worrying about Manziel page clicks, how about some digging to find out who the Browns might actually take?

    I guess in some senses, Manziel to Cleveland would be the most appropriate thing to happen. Given how our traditional media is already completely irrelevant, the PD may as well just turn into TMZ.

    • i say again to you my kentucky friend: andy freaking dalton behind only peyton manning in RZ TD pct.

      this is not because dalton is good.
      the ol’ ‘explosivity’ theory is so much jive (see tavon and kendall).
      give me three beasts who can win jump balls and a QB who knows where to put it.

      srsly, it’s not rocket science but it is science.

      • maxfnmloans

        I’d take Evans over Watkins, but I still say if they think there is a QB who can be better than Hoyer, they should make sure they get him and not hope for a slide.

        • Dave Kolonich

          I’m really hoping there isn’t another overinflated run like the Ponder-Locker-Gabbert year. None of these QB’s are truly worth a first rounder – but in NFL draft reality, that means they will be.

          • maxfnmloans

            I think there is definitely going to be a QB push this year. By the time it gets to 26, I think 4 QBs could be off the board. I’m not buying what the “experts” say.

            I also think we are uniquely situated to grab a guy and let him sit for a year. Especially with the new rookie wage scale being more team friendly than it used to be. I think that they should draft a QB, and then immediately announce Hoyer as the starter, and nip all that “QB controversy” in the bud

      • Dave Kolonich

        But alas, your argument makes the assumption that the Browns offense can first move the ball into the red zone. I sense that things will improve over last year’s squad, but let’s not take anything for granted with this team.

        And LOL for the numbers being thrown around for Dalton (10-17 mil a year). Part of the joy of living in these parts is Marvin Lewis coaching in January. Yes please for another few years of Dalton meltdowns.

        Seriously, if Dalton gets even half of that, AJ Green deserves 3 billion dollars a year.

        • that chargers playoff game. a cornucopia of dalton lolcat gifs.

          • Petefranklin

            I’ve been waiting for a chance to add to the rumor mill. According (3rd hand from a cabbie) to a current member of the Bengals, Cincy is eyeing a QB in the first round. What happens in Vegas, well, someone gets drunk and blabs to a taxi driver that the team is not happy with Dalton. If Jesus Football falls to the Bungles, he is their man.

          • i wouldve taken carr for the bengals in the #KRM just sayin.
            actually did see a rumor about bridgewater to the bengals.
            let’s face it: the suckitutde of andy dalton is vastly underreported.


    • mgbode

      Manziel to Cleveland could very well happen too.

      #1 either Houston or Atlanta takes Clowney
      #2 St.L is taking Greg Robinson (firm belief)
      #3 Jacksonville takes Watkins or Evans (decent chance)

      #4 Haslam bursts into the war-room in Berea shouting “GIVE ME JOHNNY FOOTBALL!!!”

      • actovegin1armstrong

        OK bode, I have a seven letter word, a thirteen letter word, but unless the word is explecativey, you have me reaching on this one.

        • saggy

          i don’t think Haslam uses the G at the end of words that end in G.

          • actovegin1armstrong

            Thank you saggy.
            I have it now. They seem to have a problem with d’s too.
            The Good ol’ Boy network has been slow to fade in some areas.

          • mgbode

            was thinking -er, but shouldn’t have been as Acto properly called out properly. I do like your suggestion for the fix.

    • jpftribe

      Other than watching Pluto emotionally vacillate with the fan base, there is nothing of value on

      Grossi has some talent and connections, he just chooses to be an arrogant, lazy, pessimistic troll. I guess that sells newspap…. ah, I mean, web banners.

      • Dave Kolonich

        I worry about Pluto. He’s a really nice guy and a genuine person. But it appears his work is declining. Hopefully, he’s okay physically.

        I still can’t get over Mary Kay calling Josh Gordon a “Miami Heat groupie” last year. I don’t think she knows what some words mean.

    • Warburton MacKinnon

      I think TMZ has more scoops and sometimes even news than the PD

  • Jim Nantz

    It would be a “Banner” move

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